Hillary Clinton speaks liberal. One line in Senator Clinton's convention speech evokes the chasm dividing Right and Left: "Most of all, I ran to stand up for all those who have been invisible to their government for eight long years." For liberals, being "invisible to their government" is the nightmare. For conservatives, it is the dream.

I agree with you regarding the chasm. However, it seems much scarier than an issue of visibility. What I find most disturbing about the Left is their salvationist outlook on government: that the government exists to save souls. And, there are so many people who seemingly want the government to save their soul that is disturbing as well.

Yeah, the phrase "We're from the government and we're here to help," scares conservatives and libertarians. That's a phrase of comfort progressives and liberals.

Elections are about qualifications. Hillary demonstrated with that spectacular speech last night that she truly fits the job description. She has now added "magnanimous" to her long list of credentials.

I wonder if some Democrats had second thoughts on their nominee after watching Hillary. It's peculiar that the person with the least to gain from attacking McCain stepped up to the plate went negative on him (even if for only a portion of the speech) in a way that the keynote speaker refused to do.

I like the story of the Marine who was pleading with her to help him. I'm sure that happened. Probably at the same time she was Rambo'ing up in the Balkans. Obama is so bad, we sometimes forget how really bad SHE is too.

In response to the Dan Flynn post....
I for one, DEFINITELY would prefer Hillary as the nominee - and I know I'm NOT alone! She has more brains and experience than the other two together.
On TV, Jay Leno was right when he said "Biden has 35 years of experience! Combined with Obama the 2 of them together have 36 years."
With the world as it is today, that's scary.

"What I find most disturbing about the Left is their salvationist outlook on government: that the government exists to save souls."

The conservative outlook is one of ignorance denying the trampling of human and constitutional rights in the name of small government. It is apparently so small right now that there is no justice for war crimes or your senator who pleaded guilty to soliciting gay sex in public. Is it so unclear that no one recognizes that the current admin. has fleeced america, lied and screwed the bottom 95% of the US with their backwards policies?

As far as Jason with such fear of the Gov., you have probably never volunteered or served a nonprofit group in your life in the name of a good much bigger than yourself and some taxation principles.

YOU! Start making sense!

New label should be: dumba$$mob

These are the people who want to pick our next leader? Jeez.

wow, cus thats a really smart comment mister... you are an arrogant 'yes man' brainwashed to believe that the government is inherently evil, sucking the toes of Mr. Flynn at a moments notice. There is a reason that they call polititions public servants... as for your blessed conservative admin., the small government just pulled off the biggest robery of all time. All I gotta say is 'thanks' from the bottom. I hope the view up there is nice.

nonprofits and volunteering envoke satisfaction and a passion for serving others. Get off your pedestal and try it sometime. Then notice how many social service agencies survive off of government, municipal to federal.

Your foundation is hypocracy and your walls are voluntary ignorance.

Well at least we know that 9/11 was an inside Bush job and Katrina was caused by the Cheney Halliburton Hurricane machine.

Wait a minute, I thought tactics like this were only perpetrated by those Right Wing thugs....

DENVER--Police in Denver arrested an ABC News producer today as he and a camera crew were attempting to take pictures on a public sidewalk of Democratic Senators and VIP donors leaving a private meeting at the Brown Palace Hotel.
Police on the scene refused to tell ABC lawyers the charges against the producer, Asa Eslocker, who works with the ABC News investigative unit.

Lefties are so dishonest, so delusional. It's quite entertaining to see how blind and stupid they are when they can't admit that Brown Shirt tactics come in all stripes.

Wow...The angry mob is very angry. I think the tears of anger get in his or her way of actually seeing the truth out there.

I am sure that many people who read and post on this site volunteer. I know Dan has, I have. But just because you think someone else doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they don't care.
"[V]olunteering envoke[s] satisfaction and a passion for serving others."(Angrymob, I think you meant 'invoke' with an 'I' but I am not a spelling bee winner either) I noticed that both of your reasons for volunteering are self serving and more about how it makes you feel than actually helping anyone else. Are you "Satisfied" after you go home from a hard hour at the soup kitchen serving food that someone else made and paid for but you get to claim the credit? Why don't YOU volunteer as I have four times in the military (serving under three different Presidents to include one who likes to cheat on his wife)or is that TOO much sacrifice from stroking your own ego. Sometimes service is not about you, it is about helping those who need help in other places besides the cushy little ergonomic organic chair made of hemp that you sit while typing at you computer(probably a mac); ignorant to the world beyond the limits of your hybrid car and studio apartment. Don't volunteer because it makes you feel satisfied and gives you passion, that is what hookers(sorry I meant exploited sex trade females) are for.

"The conservative outlook is one of ignorance denying the trampling of human and constitutional rights in the name of small government. It is apparently so small right now that there is no justice for war crimes or your senator who pleaded guilty to soliciting gay sex in public."(Angrymob)

OK I will bite...My rights have not been trampled upon and I imagine that yours haven't either, although your imaginary rights may have been, you know the rights not really enumerated anywhere just imagined but justices who like to pull things out of the air. As for war crimes...(please don't say Haditha, you were not there and nor were you in the courtroom to hear the evidence or able to view it all. And Abu Graib doesn't quite qualify either since some in our society are actually turned on by dog collars and some very "esteemed" politicians even like to put cigars where they don't belong)

But that aside I made sure that you have been quoted. I don't want to be the guy(Apparently YOUR Senator, if you are from Delaware, I am from North Carolina and Elizabeth Dole did not plead guilty to soliciting gay sex with anyone, nor did Richard Burr) who runs for office as a potential VP and be considered a plagiarizer who failed a 1st year law class at Syracuse University School of Law due to not wanting to put the work in that was required.

Throw stones and you may get a couple back. Let's see how angry the mob is this time. Could be fun.

Haven't you ever seen the movie Troll? Seriously, I can't be the only one.

Don't feed 'em. Especially after midnight.

Or...crap, the 80s are such a blur.

Gremlins! Dude it's Gremlins! or Gremlins 2. with the Mogwai.

I dawned on me last night that I could also adopt the 'angrymob' label, albeit from a more Rightist perspective.

It also dawned on me that I let these people pi$$ me off too much and too easily.

Just that they are so damn wrong!

Mea Culpa.

I dawned on me last night that I could also adopt the 'angrymob' label, albeit from a more Rightist perspective.

It also dawned on me that I let these people pi$$ me off too much and too easily.

Just that they are so d@mn wrong!

Me@ Culpa.

Well, I can be an instigator as Dan can attest to if he could remember that far back.

Your comments were right on Mike. Probably because you thought about them and they were based in truths.

I know it won't end until Obama ends but it's getting so tiring having to listen to and rebut leftists with facts which result in no subsequent legitimate discussion.

Just lies and tired old liberal bromides and chants. Or the occasional nutty incoherent response.

As Mike Savage says: Liberism is a mental disorder.

Most times when they open their mouths, that much is true.

"Why don't YOU volunteer as I have four times in the military"

Sorry, but I am anti-murder, especially if it is preemptive.

"I noticed that both of your reasons for volunteering are self serving and more about how it makes you feel than actually helping anyone else."

Sorry, but if you are going to flout your service too, I bet you have some satisfaction as well from it. As for developing a 'passion for serving others', wow, could I be any more selfish than to devote my entire career to helping people less fortunate than I. Why did I go to college? Sure to get a degree, but that was in turn to serve others. I am a selfish bastard.

"My rights have not been trampled upon and I imagine that yours haven't either"

It is your right to not have a warrantless search and seizure, that your admin. denied and broke even after the attorney general told him not to. You have the right to habeas corpus which Bush trampled. It is your right to vote as a citizen, but the Fed. Sup. Court upheld the Virginia law restricting that right to a person with a state photo ID. Bye bye right to vote if you are poor or homeless.

For example: In primary elections held in Indiana not long after the ruling, elderly nuns who do not drive were among those eligible voters turned away from the voting booth because they could not produce the requisite government-issued photo IDs. (Taken from D. Hastings, “Indiana Nuns Lacking ID Denied at Poll by Fellow Sister,” The Evening News & The Tribune (May 6, 2008)

There are countless ways this admin. has trampled the rights of our citizens. The words "patriot act" basicaly give this admin. cart blanch to trample rights.

Yet you still feel it has not affected YOUR life, but like I said earlier, your position is one of ignorance denying the trampling of human and constitutional rights in the name of small government. The same small gov. that wants to take away your rights.

And ASDF, bring some friggin substance to the table or shut up. Last I checked, the Denver Police are part of the Executive Branch under the leadership of W., not some democratic militia doing the bidding of some DNC administrator. You bring more shady assumptions and generalizations than anybody else on this board with no facts to back anything up. Sit down.

I wasn't always so selfless. I used to work in construction, but I hadda leave that for..certain reasons...

See, I used to wear little shorts on the job and whatnot and they would fire little pipes and bricks and bottles of beer at me.

And I don't go that way.

Do you know what I'm saying?

"Last I checked, the Denver Police are part of the Executive Branch under the leadership of W.,"

Check again since they(the Denver police) work for the City of Denver which has an executive called a "mayor" who in turn may report to the executive of the state of Colorado. You may have heard that person being called "Governor". They don't work for the Honorable George W. Bush. They work for the State.

"Why did I go to college? Sure to get a degree, but that was in turn to serve others. I am a selfish bastard."

A bit of an "elitist" comment (or a bit of shame and embarrassment maybe) since I never brought up the topic of a college education. But you must assume (remember what assuming does?) that because I went in to the service that I am stupid. Didn't some democratic presidential hopeful say something to that effect? But never-mind, your assumptions are incorrect and show your ignorance of others points of view. There are many people who forgo there own aspirations of education to go into the military. That is what some may call a sacrifice. Those of us who finally do decide that we want that education do go to college and get degrees. And then some of us go back into the military to lead and serve others as officers. And then some us of actually get to go back to school and get graduate degrees to further our service to country. So lets see... that's enlisted, deployed to help those less fortunate, got degree, earned commission, lead servicemen in missions that helped more people less fortunate than you or I, got the military to send me to law school, and will continue to serve my country. But I am still assumed to be stupid by people like you. Why would someone go in to the military; didn't they get into college?!?! They must not be smart enough to do anything else, or they are poor and can't afford it. Becuase we always send the poor to fight "Americas Wars of Empire". I imagine that is what James McCain, an infantryman with 1st Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment believed he was doing while he was deployed to Iraq. Oh and the last name... yes it is Senator John McCain's son. Service is important to many of us and for all the right reasons.

"Yet you still feel it has not affected YOUR life"

WTF! I can spell that out for you phonetically if you like, and tell you what it really means too if you are too slow to understand. I imagine that you have sacrificed nothing compared to me. You have not conquered adversity on a level even close to mine. You have not felt pain, suffered, starved, and bleed for anyone. But I digress(the anger must come from all the MMA fights I have been watching lately) and I also assume(must be the more liberal portion of me getting all angry and throwing insults) that your cushy life can't compare to the type that I have had. Although my life gets better everyday and I am better off than I was 8, 10 and 12 years ago.

"It is your right to vote as a citizen, but the Fed. Sup. Court[The appropriate abbreviated title would be the "U.S. Sup. Ct."(The Bluebook: A Uniform System of Citation, 339 The Harvard Law Review et al. ed.(2005))I don't want you to confuse the dumb service persons here, you can check that out if you like] upheld the Virginia law restricting that right to a person with a state photo ID. Bye bye right to vote if you are poor or homeless[...]"

....or to those who would like to impersonate dead people, or vote for you since you don't need to show ID. What sense does that make?

Potential Voter "Hi I am Mary Smith and I would like to vote"
Election Bd. "But SIR is your name really Mary you look more like a Bob to me."
Potential Voter "My name is Mary, it says it on this piece of mail I stole, I mean got today."
Election Bd. "Oh OK, since we have really no way of stopping you then go ahead and vote."

Bring out the doom and gloom examples that happened to three people out of 280 million. In many, and I mean like a whole lot, states issue Id's for a nominal fee or are entirely free to offset the argument regarding the poor or homeless(and no they don't need an address in many places a street will do fine. If they don't know what street the generally sleep on then maybe they aren't fit to vote.)

You other arguments are debatable, and thankfully you are on the losing side of the debate.
I need to get back to studying, and thank you for the tax dollars you are paying for my legal education.(You must think that is a complete waste since service personnel don't go to college.) Once complete I will hopefully be able to try some of the Gitmo detainees. I will be done in less than three years and some may still be there for me to prosecute. Or I may be able to defend some service persons who have been wrongfully accused with regard to supposed war crimes. (Another Marine was acquitted today) I know that burns you up.

One last thing, a law professor told the class a joke today...
If you are 20 years old and a conservative then you have no heart.
If you are 40 years old and a liberal then you have no brain.

Often times reality is found in humor.

Sorry Dan, that was a little long. But i did get it in before midnight so the gremlins might not come out tonight.

"I wasn't always so selfless. I used to work in construction, but I hadda leave that for..certain reasons...

See, I used to wear little shorts on the job and whatnot and they would fire little pipes and bricks and bottles of beer at me.

And I don't go that way.

Do you know what I'm saying?"

Ummm... No, I don't. I didn't realize that contruction workers were selfish. I will have to tell my buddies who are construction workers that. Or are you implying that all people who work with their hands can't go to college becuase they are stupid (see how I pulled that out of no where? It's like freakin liberal magic; pulling a statement out of no where that doesn't relate to anything about the topic and attacking someone with it.) I will learn your ways and use them against you.

Being gay isn't that bad, I wasn't always so gay, but I learned to suck D. Flynns cock and like it. One time he stuck it in my ear, and ever since I have voted republican.

read the email address and know I am not writing every comment under my name. I will not conjure arguments from the void of space, nor will I insult soldiers, people with a rational argument, or someone because they don't have an education.

I commend your service to the country, I have had good friends in the military. Never would I assume that soldiers aren't smart enough for school or too stupid for whatever educational path they take. I believe the G.I. bill is one of the greatest things to happen for our military, I just wish it was adequate enough in these times. I never even alluded to "since service personnel don't go to college." or "But you must assume (remember what assuming does?) that because I went in to the service that I am stupid. " Where did that come from?

I really don't even care about the 'war crimes' of the enlisted men anywhere close to the severity of W.'s invasion and coup of a sovereign country. It is the admin. that has the blood on their hands, but will never see justice.

As for the Denver Police, I'm busted... lol, it is not good to type emotionally, as we all know how fed., state, and local gov. is divided. And I would blame asdf for the construction comment...

for the comment:"Are you "Satisfied" after you go home from a hard hour at the soup kitchen serving food that someone else made and paid for but you get to claim the credit?"

Sorry, but it is more like 8 hours a day, with about 1/3-1/4 the pay of what I could easily be making in the private sector. As for satisfaction from the credit I receive, where do I get praise for my actions? The clients that I serve? That's cool and all, but it might as well be nothing because there is no satisfaction in getting the 'credit' for what happens. My satisfaction comes from seeing people turning their lives around and making profound changes for the better (e.g. kicking a meth dependency, helping a mother escape from a domestic violence husband and start over, feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, helping a boy with terminal leukimia to get treatment when everyone questions the reason when he's,'just going to die anyway') . I feel good living a christian life even though I may not believe in the pope, because the true christian asks not for praise for his actions because he already knows they are right and just. So no, I do not claim the credit for services rendered, I am thankful to be an instrument that helps change lives. I hope to live as a model that inspires others to denounce the luxeries of self-interest in the name of helping other people.

Angrymob took my moniker! What do I do now?

Got to go to class, I may post later but this conversation has gone from "attack to feel sorry for me becuase I help your huddled masses", so i think I will talk later.

Angrymob, you show your foolish uninformed immaturity in spades everytime you rant.

Please don't use my name to post something so tedious just to get a rise.

Sadly, it's the only way that leftists can vent I suppose as they can not back up most of what they say.

asdf= a small dicked f*cker, another slave devoted to flynn, act smart defend fascism, abandon sanity defeat freedom, active sophist defeating fundamental logic, aged sex-offender duping females. Or is it 'alone suffering, depression and fear'?

Please close this thread.

Not yet Homer. I have to come back with my 'Nyah, nyah, na, nyah nyah' defense.

You ever notice how the bad names and insults start flying when a liberal gets trounced with solid logic?

Back to the subject (The Invisable Man)

"Invisable" in Hillaryspeak is translated...
"Not yet enrolled in Big Gov't givaway programs".